Globalization

[Sorrow]

Here's one for you!
a new discussion!

what's your take on Globalization?

[Caste]

The only way to survive

[Sorrow]

why?
arguments please

[Persol]

I tend to think about globalization as what the 13 colonies did when they formed the USA, or what the EU is doing now... but on a much larger scale.

Think of the things you consider most wrong with the world... I'd pick (in order) famine, sickness, war, miscellaneous hate.

Globalization helps the first three. The more interdependant we are the more reasons we have to make sure they are fed and healthy, and that much less reason to start a war with them.


The problem is that states need to maintain their individual sovernty... and the states must be held responsible by their citizens. As far as I can see, this is the only requirement to globalization being a good thing... if the countries involved don't meet this standard then globalization is likely to lead to short term explotation. In the long run however, ever that corrects itself. (South Korea is a good example)


Now, the problem

[5eyes]

Also matters on who the major players of globalization are, don't need the anti-christ or a bunch of terrorists taking the helm. I think globalization as its going now may not turn out the best result, but eventually it will get better. The USA in its infancy was a crap chute (Articles of Confederation), but over time was able to grow and thrive. Same with the E.U., as it grows it'll get better (unless major mistakes are made, but I doubt that at this point).

As I see it, theres a good chance more countries in different regions will create unions, basically making them super-countries, and at some point either they will unite with each other... or mass war, but hopfully unity.

[Sorrow]

Imo "terrorists" are over-rated just like the communists were, another excuse to divert the people's attention away from the homeland and its poor financial state, you're being sucked dry by the rich and nobody's stopping it. but that's not entirely on topic.

Globalization has its advantages, like this, us, talking about it via some medium called the internet.
but it mostly favours mega-corporations and the already-rich people. (atleast the Economic-side of Globalization, see Free-trade doesn't exactly favour the third world countries.)

[Persol]

Imo "terrorists" are over-rated just like the communists were

Terrorists are overrated. Communism, not so much.

Communism is a method of running society that sounds great, but generally ends up consolidating power to a few.

but it mostly favours mega-corporations and the already-rich people

Well, two things. First, that's why minimum standards are needed. If the government is representative of the entire population, imbalances like this will still happen... but the normal population will also benefit.

It doesn't really matter if 10 people become billionares... as long as the rest of the population also gets benefits and a better life.

[5eyes]

true, mega-corps can get an advantage from globalization, but also the idea of a centralized hub for countries to discuss what they all wish to do, they can stop those corporations.

and terrorists are not overrated, commies may have been, but they failed, crashed and burned, no worries now, except for the bunch of ppl in the USA who want to change the country into a communist nation.... off topic

[RSX WHEEEEEE]

if by globalization you mean making the world one big country, then yes i am for it. There would be international law codes and enforcers, [hopefully] making it harder for terrorism to prevail. We can also gentrify poor places.

[Persol]

Just to end this terrorist argument for globalization... globalization will only help if it helps make a police state. Not much of a trade off.

In reality, terrorism is a minor problem compared to quality of living issues and should have little impact in an analysis of globalization being good or bad. You (as a human being) are almost millions of times more likely to starve to death than be killed by a terrorist.

There's real issues here... terrorism isn't on of them (although crime in general may be).

[Mango]

Globalisation has the image of a necessary evil, that the world is so unsecure and on-the-brink that we need the international community to pull together and standardise everything. This is a load of crap.

Throughout the 20th century we have seen the efforts of the few to consolidate power, wealth and influence into fewer and fewer hands. This is the same process you see before you, it's happening right now. The process involves forming countries into 'economic blocs' as a way of consolidating their economies - though it will be sold to you as a way of "making business transactions smoother and more productive", then eventually these economic blocs will form into a super-state. The Pan-American Union will eventually merge with the European Union, this WILL happen if the globalists have their way.

So what's wrong with that? Let's take the EU as an example: they suck huge amounts of wealth from the richest countries, the UK alone gives them 1.3 million pounds per-hour. Legislation is homogenised and we lose our national sovereignty and descision making priviledges. "But surely the MPs can still vote at the EU?" I hear you cry.

You're right they do, but the EU is an exercise of bureaucratic insanity. Not only do the EU taxpayers pay for the MPs to move office every few weeks (which costs thousands of pounds) but the voting process is compartmentalisation taken to its concievable limits.

An MP might be asked to vote on 500 pieces of legislature in a single day. Many of these issues are grouped in numbers of 20 or more, and an MP is expected to vote on a single 'yes' or 'no' to each group. A single piece of legislature from a single group might be comprised of 200 pages. Even with their team of researchers (normally numbering from 2-5) cannot possibly hope to cover everything. The EU works on a system of monumental bureaucratic obfusification. So how can they vote in an educated fashion?

They can't. What happens is each party gives their MPs a list of party policy and they simply follow the formula, punching in a 'yes' or 'no' depending on what their party decides best. This is the EU's form of democracy. Many MPs don't even bother to read the items, just punch in the numbers and off to the bar they go.

Welcome to the future of international politics.

The absolute worst aspect of globalisation is the consolidation of economies. Our central banks aren't owned or employed by our governments, they are private banking institutons. The banking system is a massive scam. When you allow an organisation to control and set the credit of a currency, you are fucked. There have been a few presidents that have tried to wrangle power from the bankers, most have been assasinated or driven out of office. (Look at Woodrow Wilson's remarks after he ratified the Fed, Jekyll Island style)

Do you think your currency is backed by gold? Better think again. Or better still, go ask the "Federal" Reserve for an audit of Fort Knox. My completly brush-based 1:1 scale map of New York (with no hint brushes) will have finished compiling on my 386 when you come back.

OK, that was a bit laboured but you get the idea. The fractional reserve system, coupled with a gold backed currency and the bankers being able to set and control credit is a black hole we have been dragged into. Wonder why our countries are in so much debt? We have been made slaves to international bankers. This subject is really to deep to go into here, but check it out for yourself. (ref: Money Masters - it's a great place to start.)

If you haven't been asleep for the past five years and haven't had your head stuck up your arse, you'll have seen the acts of utter evil and dehumanisation our supposed leaders have inflicted upon us and the rest of the world. You think these people give a shit about you? They don't, and they're gonna make our lives a living hell if we let them. Don't trust the UN to sort things out with their international police force and international criminal court. (remember homogenising?)

Now, I'm not the xenophobic race hater the moronic might assume I am. I see the system for what it is. I'm not against a one-world state, because let's face it: we're all human, right? But I am against a one-world state, their New World Order, when it's ran like this, by people like this. Don't get sucked in, we've been fucked over so many times you'd think we'd have learnt by now. Perhaps not.

"The only thing worth globalising is dissent." -Arundhati Roy

[dragonfliet]

Hehe. Mango, you started off pretty well, but went on an interesting tangent there.

When you talk about globalization, what's the definition? A push away from Nationalism and towards Globalism in a political, identity kind of a sense? That would be swell and all, but it would take an outside force (ie: aliens or colonized other planets) in order to move such a thing forward. Despite Mango's paranoia, systems like the EU and the UN are essentially powerless when it really counts. They do a good job of helping to fight tariffs, providing a (someone) neutral judicial system to mitigate disputes and a great financial incentive to reform (those are mostly attribitable to the EU, the UN has much, much less power and covers a much, much greater spectrum). In the end though, all countries within such agreements maintain their soveriegnty, which completely undermines the system. All they have to do is take their ball and go home should they disagree (to the point of extreme's-this isn't an everyday thing, it does have repurcussions). Thus, compliance is voluntary, and there is no real way to force it on someone.

Then you have globalization as far as free trade goes. As far as that's concerned, I'm all for it. What that does is knocks down barriers such as tariffs (and subsidies) on goods and allows for the free importing and exporting of materials. This allows for more jobs to go to the more destitute countries (because they're cheaper). Yes, this does cause people to get their panties in a twist, because then the evil giant corporations are exploiting the poor, innocent workers, but the fact of the matter is that the influx of jobs does a great deal. The outsourcing of Tech Jobs to India (from the US at least) has caused a HUGE explosion of the Middle class in India. Customers get tech support (with a mild annoyance of language barries), software developement cheap (because we're cheap basatards) and companies can cut out the bloat. Of course high paid american's are grumpy about that but, well, it's better for the world, so too bad for you.

There's plenty more to talk about, but I'll see what the babble have to say about this and we'll move from there.

~Jason loves talking political science.

Perhaps you mean

[Persol]

The absolute worst aspect of globalisation is the consolidation of economies. Our central banks aren't owned or employed by our governments, they are private banking institutons. The banking system is a massive scam. When you allow an organisation to control and set the credit of a currency, you are fucked. There have been a few presidents that have tried to wrangle power from the bankers, most have been assasinated or driven out of office. (Look at Woodrow Wilson's remarks after he ratified the Fed, Jekyll Island style)

I'm sorry... but your entire post is not backed ion reality. This paragraph is by far the worst.

We ALREADY HAVE a consolidated economy, it just happens to use various currencies. Just because it goes by different names in different countries doesn't mean that all of currency isn't already linked.

Unless you want to go back to the barter system, someone is setting the 'credit of currency'.

The fractional reserve system, coupled with a gold backed currency and the bankers being able to set and control credit is a black hole we have been dragged into.

This is no longer realistic. you'd have to make the assumption that gold is worth more than it really is. It makes no more sense than backing your economy with peanuts.

If you haven't been asleep for the past five years and haven't had your head stuck up your arse, you'll have seen the acts of utter evil and dehumanisation our supposed leaders have inflicted upon us and the rest of the world.

This has as much to do with globalization as it does with democracy, or islam, or christianty. People can abuse most government actions, this included.

But I am against a one-world state, their New World Order, when it's ran like this, by people like this. Don't get sucked in, we've been fucked over so many times you'd think we'd have learnt by now. Perhaps not.

There is a difference between globalization and a central government.

[dragonfliet]

Oh yeah, thanks persol, I meant to comment on the fact that we haven't had a gold standard currency for a LOOOONG time. It's not a particularly practical thing.

~Jason

[Persol]

Of course high paid [people] are grumpy about that but, well, it's better for the world, so too bad for you.

And you just hit the nail on the head. People are unwilling to give up their coffee double latte with lemon, even though it means someone in a third world country will finally be able to make enough money to buy a house.

The 'first world' gives up hardly anything compared to what is gained by everyone else.
(course, this only applies to economic globalization. Political globalization is a misnomer)