U.S. House votes down bailout deal

[Mr-Jigsaw]

Alright, this has strayed far from the original topic but I've been watching the first video.

This is the most ridiculous conspiracy bullshit I've ever seen. What you conspiracy theorists fail to realize is that no one group of people stay in government control for very long periods of time. And the sheer scale and depth of the corruption would be too great to keep hidden. You are talking about thousands to tens of thousands of government employess. There is no way this many could keep their mouths shut. And why would they want to? What stake would they have in this huge conspiracy, NONE! What would a simple ATF agent want in such a world, they would be controlled just like everyone else. Are they afraid? How could they be, the government is only so powerful.

And you forget motives, its easy to piece together events and evidence to prove that the government perpetrated these attacks on their own people, but without a motive. Unless you manufacture a retarded one. Yes, the elite want to reduce the world's population by 80 percent and cramp everyone in small cities with ID chips implanted under the skin and issue national IDs. This is bullshit. What would they get out of this world? NOTHING!

This Alex Jones is a joke. Real reporters let the viewer decide, not force your stupid theories upon them at every chance. Neutral commentary is very necessary when trying to convince an audience. No wonder this guy isn't a real reporter. The only reason anyone believes him is because they already believed there was a conspiracy and now they have a crazy story to support it. And I hope your ealize that whole intro scene was superfluous and just added to scare people. He claims all these things about the government trying to keep people in fear but then edits the film in fearmongering ways. Not to mention the really stupid spinning picture of Bin Laden and the badly cutout CIA logo spinning around. This is terribly unprofessional, at best.

Ok, lets just pretend what he says is true. If the elite were so ruthless as he claims they are, why wouldn't they hesitate to silence him? WHY? Because there is no validity to his claims.

And I don't think its a matter of me having the stones, but having the time to watch all of them.

Back to the bailout...it sucks.

[Mango]

This is the most ridiculous conspiracy bullshit I've ever seen. What you conspiracy theorists fail to realize is that no one group of people stay in government control for very long periods of time.

If you can control the parties that get into government you can continue control.

And the sheer scale and depth of the corruption would be too great to keep hidden. You are talking about thousands to tens of thousands of government employess.

What if the system is so well engineered, and society is brainwashed and imprinted with false beliefs and values, large parts of society can be made to unwittingly participate in an evil system. Hitler, Stalin, Mao - how could it be explained otherwise, right?

There is no way this many could keep their mouths shut. And why would they want to?

There are hundreds of government officials from around the globe who have gone public about 9/11 being an inside job. German Defense Minister, ex-Japanese Primeminister, UK Labour Minister, former Italian Primeminister, former CIA section chief of Western Europe.

How about http://911scholars.org/ - Architects and engineers who think 9/11 was an inside job. People like:

Michael M. Andregg (FM)

Domestic intelligence, Justice and Peace Studies, St. Thomas University, St. Paul, MN

Mark Bamberger, Ph.D. (FM)

Professor of Geology and Environmental Sciences, Miami University and Capital University

Kevin Barrett (FM)

Folklore, UW-Madison; Director, Khidria, Inc.; Founding Member, Muslim-Jewish-Christian Alliance for 9/11 Truth, mujca.com

Philip J. Berg, Esq. (FM)

Attorney at Law, Former Deputy Attorney General, former candidate for Governor, Lt. Governor, and U.S. Senate from Pennsylvania, whose website, 911forthetruth.com, covers the RICO lawsuit that is pending against Bush, Cheney and 53 other Defendantsin Federal Court, Southern District of New York

Tracy Blevins (FM)

Bioengineering, Rice University

Robert M. Bowman (FM)

Former Director of the U.S. "Star Wars" Space Defense Programin both Republican and Democratic administrations, and a former Air ForceLieutenant Colonel with 101 combat missions

This is a small selection.

What stake would they have in this huge conspiracy, NONE! What would a simple ATF agent want in such a world, they would be controlled just like everyone else. Are they afraid? How could they be, the government is only so powerful.

Those who are involved with the corruption get benefits, it's like a crime syndicate. Remember, I said not ALL ATF agents are involved with dirty stuff. SOME are, and they are usually at the TOP. The fish rots from the head down, you heard that expression before?

And you forget motives, its easy to piece together events and evidence to prove that the government perpetrated these attacks on their own people, but without a motive. Unless you manufacture a retarded one.

You want to talk about motives? How about global control, that's a pretty decent motive right? How about trillions of dollars of weapons and defense contracts? How about a totally consolidated financial system? How about setting the precedent to invade countries illegally? How about geo-political control of the major pipeline routes? How about global empire?

Those sound like pretty good motives to you? Are you sure you watched the film, Alex says why they did it. He talked about empire.

Yes, the elite want to reduce the world's population by 80 percent and cramp everyone in small cities with ID chips implanted under the skin and issue national IDs. This is bullshit. What would they get out of this world? NOTHING!

They get the ability to track and trace the entire population of the planet through advanced super computers. They get a dictatorship. Hitler would've loved this stuff. I'm sure you know that IBM manufactured the tabulation machines used to catalogue the people sent to the death camps.

This Alex Jones is a joke. Real reporters let the viewer decide, not force your stupid theories upon them at every chance. Neutral commentary is very necessary when trying to convince an audience. No wonder this guy isn't a real reporter. The only reason anyone believes him is because they already believed there was a conspiracy and now they have a crazy story to support it. And I hope your ealize that whole intro scene was superfluous and just added to scare people. He claims all these things about the government trying to keep people in fear but then edits the film in fearmongering ways.

Because it's fucking scary? He's trying to show you how horrifying it is going to be. What's the matter, you can't separate the information from the way it's presented? I'm sure you watch the corporate news: you don't think they try influence your opinion?

If he's such a Joke why has he been on US, UK, Russian, Iranian, Japanese mainline television? If he's such a joke, why has he had hundreds of reputable guests on his radio show over the years?
Investigative journalist, Greg Palast
Father of Reganomics, economist and nationally syndicated columnist , Paul Craig Roberts
Congressman Ron Paul

Why has he talked for 9/11 truth and government corruption with people like,
artist, Willie Nelson
retired professional wrestler, Navy UDT veteran, actor, and former radio and television talk show host, and Governor of Minnasota, Jesse Ventura
actor, Charlie Sheen
actor, CHUCK NORRIS
author and political activist, Naomi Wolf
President of Environmental Perspectives, Inc., and Executive Director of Sovereignty International, Michael Coffman, Ph.D
Richard Gage of Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth.
German Defense minister, Andreas Von Bullo
both ex-Italian and Japanese primeministers
Dennis Kucinich and his brave effort to have George W. Bush impeached for war crimes, trashing the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, and a litany of other abuses and high crimes.
Eva Orner, who produced the documentary Taxi to the Dark Side, winner of the 2008 Academy Award for Best Documentary and the Critics’ Award at the Cannes Film Festival.
Charlotte Iserbyt, former Senior Policy Advisor in the Office of Educational Research and Improvement

I could go on.

Not to mention the really stupid spinning picture of Bin Laden and the badly cutout CIA logo spinning around. This is terribly unprofessional, at best.

I'm sorry the 2004 production values don't match the high standard you're used to. That's an Infowars logo I believe. Representative of the http://www.infowars.com website that Alex Jones operates.

Ok, lets just pretend what he says is true. If the elite were so ruthless as he claims they are, why wouldn't they hesitate to silence him? WHY? Because there is no validity to his claims.

The elite have killed prominent people. They don't want to draw attention to what he's saying, and underline or add an exclamation point to his message.

So?
These are all logical arguments, and I understand why you are asking them, I really do. I asked all these questions to myself once too. So answer me this: which specific pieces of information from the film are you disputing?

[Mango]

So that's it then, is it?

[Mr-Jigsaw]

Its hard to find time to watch all the those videos through, you know, classes and stuff. And it would probably be prudent to make a new thread rather than veer this bailout thread down a different path.

[Mango]

Yeah, I understand. In a couple of days I'll probably start a challenge thread where I invite members to prove me wrong, I'd like you to participate.

Speak to you soon, hopefully.
Mango

[Mango]

http://skeptically.org/wto/id6.html World Bank: Chief Economist, Stiglitz Goes Public.
I hope THIS sounds familiar!