Ryder's Race and Life Predictions

[Zipfinator]

Well in the chat there was a debate where me and Surfa debated on predictions Ryder was making up based on the progression of races throughout history and how things would be if certain events didn't happen, such as if the Colonies slavery of Africa hadn't happened. So I'd like to know if you guys think that his statements are complete bullshit or if you think that they actually had some possibility of actually happening. (Note that Ryder agreed for me to post the conversation and his predictions and I'm not just posting it here without him knowing to be an ass)

Here is the main conversation (Note that I have removed parts that were not in our conversation and am not removing posts by either me or Ryder to change your perceptions on the argument):

Cryder: white people always failed throughout history
Cryder: especially americans
Cryder: you just try to hide the fact by hating people who aren't white
Zipfinator: Yeah
Zipfinator: You got me figured out Ryder
Cryder: yep
Surfa: damn
Cryder: now stop being an insecure fag
Surfa: a white man invented the computer
Cryder: so what
Surfa: so what have black people done then
Zipfinator: They found uses for peanuts
Cryder: everyone else was evolving and creating the foundations of civilization while white people were fucking their own sisters and spreading plauges
Zipfinator: Do you have a citation on that?
Surfa: funny that how most white poeple contributed to the advancing technology
Cryder: they only did so because they tried to 'catch up' by oppressing other races
BlekksPoncho: they have been a very successful scapegoat
Cryder: they used african americans as slaves to build one of the most powerful countries in the world
Zipfinator: lol Surfa just ignore Ryder
Cryder: what if they had said 'fuck you' and refused
Cryder: you'd have no country right now
Zipfinator: So how is that fail on White People?
Zipfinator: And they took them by force Ryder lol
Cryder: what im saying is
Surfa: then they would still be in tribes
Zipfinator: It's not like the Africans wanted to be slaves
Cryder: actually surfa
Cryder: they probably wouldn't
Cryder: africans would probably be where white people are right now
Cryder: europeans came to africa and fucked everything up with there barbarism and diseases
Cryder: thats why its the way it is now
Surfa: so they would magically make a huge technological advance
Cryder: no
Srredfire: I don't think this debate
Cryder: they'd be ahead of you
Cryder: thats for sure
Srredfire: is going to solve
Srredfire: anything
Zipfinator: lol
Srredfire: There isn't going to be a resolution
Zipfinator: It's just Ryder making up shit
Srredfire: No one is gonna say
Zipfinator: I'm just ignoring it now
Srredfire: LOL YOU'RE RIGHT
Cryder: no im just proving that everyone is > caucasians
Cryder: I'm not making up anything
Cryder: you're just a ignorant motherfucker
Cryder: you need to learn your history Zipfinator
Cryder: most of what I got was from my latin and history classes where we breifly talked about civilization after the fall of rome
Zipfinator: Ryder
Zipfinator: Taking those classes doesn't give you some degree that lets you make up predictions on how life would be if things hadn't happened
Cryder: I'm not predicting, im assuming based on the progress that they were making before europeans screwed up everything
Cryder: Zipfinator, everything you say has no depth or logical reasoning, and history contradicts it all

Here is the summary of what Ryder thinks using quotes from the conversation posted above:

-"everyone else was evolving and creating the foundations of civilization while white people were fucking their own sisters and spreading plauges"

-Caucasians were only able to contribute to many of the worlds greatests technological advancements such as Computers because they "tried to 'catch up' by oppressing other races"

-If the slaves "had said 'fuck you' and refused you'd have no country right now"

-"africans would probably be where white people are right now" if the slavery of them hadn't happened

-"europeans came to africa and fucked everything up with there barbarism and diseases, thats why its the way it is now"

-"im just proving that everyone is > caucasians"

-"most of what I got was from my latin and history classes where we breifly talked about civilization after the fall of rome"

-"I'm not predicting, im assuming based on the progress that they were making before europeans screwed up everything"


So what do you guys think? Would these things Ryder is "assuming based on the progress that they were making before europeans screwed up everything" actually have happened if other events hadn't?

[Surfa]

I would like to point out that I don't believe that white people are better than black people just that black people aren't better than whites. Wait that still sounds racist. Throughout time we have proven that we can be as bad as each other and I believe it isn't until we look past race as a whole that we won't fully evolve to our species fullest potential. Great now I sound like a hippy oh well.

[SwampyTurtle]

if white people are the reason that the world is fucked up? why is a black man in the white house. by that logic we can determine that "the election was rigged" and that the only reason Obama is in the white house is because white men control politics....

see that doesnt add up. I think like Surfa said that everyone is equal and that most of what cryder said is trash. Coming from a History major, 90% of the context he used to justify why black people are better and how europeans messed everything up is also trash. Therefore, we can determine (again) that cryder is talking about things he doesnt understand.

[The Wanderer]

Did someone say "assume"?

God, now i have to kill a kitten...

no seriously, i hate when people make assumptions, they are useless and trying to argue to people making assumptions is like asking a brick wall to boogie...

[MELVIn]

This definitely deserves it's own thread...

[Jman]

Did someone say "assume"?

God, now i have to kill a kitten...

no seriously, i hate when people make assumptions, they are useless and trying to argue to people making assumptions is like asking a brick wall to boogie...

If we hadn't oppressed brick walls for hundreds of years they'd be able to boogie by now.

[CorporalAris]

How about this: No one is better than each other.

[stoopdapoop]

how about "ryder is 13, and he has a tendency to talk shit about everything, but doesn't actually know anything about anything."

I'm glad he doesn't post on the forums like he used to.

I'm not sure why you guys would dignify any of his senseless ramblings with a thread though. If people don't know who he is, or what he's saying, they're better off.

[popcornjake]

Cultures might be more technologically developed than another, though race does not factor into that, only the society they were raised in.
Though in saying that, a technologically superior society/culture is not necessarily morally superior to another, or superior in any other sense outside of materialistic points.
Basically, we're all part of the same species and equal and while we may have different values and beliefs due to where we grew up and under which circumstances, our actual genetic race does not affect that, and a change in values and beliefs and whatever else does not lead to one group of people to be superior of another.

Though I do agree that Europeans have caused a lot of problems over history - Europe was very much the centre of the world. Primitive peoples from anywhere with that influence would have used their technological and theoretical superiority to manipulate those cultures and societies which were not as progressed as their own (such as slavery of Africans, worldwide British imperialism), though that manipulation does not equate them to be superior in any sense other than that of a social hierarchy (a heirarchy which only would have applied back then, not now).

Oh god, I don't even know what I'm saying. In short: we're all homo sapiens and while our cultures may be different, we're all the same in the end, with no race/society/nation standing out as superior to the rest.

EDIT: I forgot to mention an exception to equality: atheists > theists

[no00dylan]

EDIT: I forgot to mention an exception to equality: atheists > theists

[RawMeat3000]

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/ban-ry ... nterlopers

[Sathor]

There is no superior "race". Why should there? We are all humans. Every "difference" is caused by natural causes, like the lack of horses and iron (the Mayas wouldn't have been killed by the Spanish if they had had horses and iron). There are regions in the world more fit to develop the society and advance like in Europe. Rich ressources, short distances, almost perfect weather conditions. Sometimes religion has influenced the possible advance in science.
While I certainly don't believe black people are inferior, I certainly don't think it is the other way round. Black people tend to the same problems as white people. I guess it was no wonder Europeans thought they were superior, given the fact they came to those other countries, finding a much less developed society in terms of technology and trade. They found people afraid of gun powder weapons, etc. What else was to do?
I guess turn the roles around, give black people the European continent from start, they would have made the same as the white ones did. They would not have done better.

Everything else is maybe protective racism. I mean, of course you can be a black racist. Against whites. But that is just as stupid as the other way round. Because it is primitive. Because THAT intolerance has caused the problems everyone is speaking of. Intolerance against other cultures, colours and whatnot. Ryder seems to have fallen for that.

[AndyMacK]

-If the slaves "had said 'fuck you' and refused you'd have no country right now"

Umm... They did. This is what being a slave means...

Oh, and you seem to have got your timelines mixed up a bit. The large majority of Africans were "still living in huts at the same time the gun was first fired". Making up for being behind 'other races'? I dispute this point. I agree that, had the entire north-west-ish hemisphere decided to leave well alone, Africa would probably not be the way it is now, but who are you to define what would have happened?
-A

[KILLA-COW]

I find this whole thing disgusting and offensive. To all races. The outrageeeeous ignorance is offensive. This is random thread material not serious discussion material.

[BlekksPoncho]

I find this whole thing disgusting and offensive. To all races. The outrageeeeous ignorance is offensive. This is random thread material not serious discussion material.

Exactly.

There is nothing wrong with assumptions and predictions but such infantile, ignorant ones don't justify debate. To debate this correctly, we would all have to be professional historians and experts on past and present cultures.

The only decent point Cryder makes is that africa wouldn't be as it is today...but then again, neither would the Americas, Asia or Europe...large cultural changes such as that of the enslaving of Africans and taking them to North America change all cultures in all of the world.

Cryder, don't start non-sensical "debates" where you speculate on incorrect things with no fact and Zip/Surfa, don't encourage him.

We can't debate this.