Interlopers.net Forum - Half-Life 2 News & Tutorials

BattleGrunt wrote:So the Sept 1st submission date for the letter has passed. What's the status on it?

When dealing with Valve, sometimes it's necessary to work in their timezone . The petition can easily do with a few more weeks or simply run until there's a response; after all, had things come to a head on the 1st, we'd have missed projectleet's rather valuable contribution.

Phott wrote:

YokaI wrote:model viewers that aren't made by some Swedish guy

What's that supposed to mean?

Maybe he's referring to Jed of wunderboy.org, however, he's not Swedish; only lives there.

Mr. Happy wrote:I support this but like M2 I think our approach is all wrong.

We should get our demands printed on some nice paper, certified and embossed by a notary public, placed into a recreation of the TF2 briefcase, have someone dress up as a scout and run in carrying the briefcase screaming TF2 quotes and seeing how far into the office they can get before someone stops them.

We could also make a touching video showing screenshots and video clips of the SDK phailing to be gud set to sad soft rock music.

Why the fuck does that sound like it would work perfectly?

Honestly I just want a less buggy and crashy Hammer, better support for Windows 7, and a revised SDK layout or something along those lines. Hammer will never be as efficient as Unreal Engine or Cryengine, but it's definitely not as stable as it should be.

And yeah, better tools for model porting sounds about right too. If I didn't have GUIStudioMDL, I don't think I would ever get a single fucking model in to Source.

nub wrote:

Mr. Happy wrote:I support this but like M2 I think our approach is all wrong.

We should get our demands printed on some nice paper, certified and embossed by a notary public, placed into a recreation of the TF2 briefcase, have someone dress up as a scout and run in carrying the briefcase screaming TF2 quotes and seeing how far into the office they can get before someone stops them.

We could also make a touching video showing screenshots and video clips of the SDK phailing to be gud set to sad soft rock music.

Why the fuck does that sound like it would work perfectly?

Honestly I just want a less buggy and crashy Hammer, better support for Windows 7, and a revised SDK layout or something along those lines. Hammer will never be as efficient as Unreal Engine or Cryengine, but it's definitely not as stable as it should be.

And yeah, better tools for model porting sounds about right too. If I didn't have GUIStudioMDL, I don't think I would ever get a single fucking model in to Source.

I don't even use the gui version D:

me either, we use QC's and command-line studiomdl.exe at work

Why do you guys want it to be so much like unreal and cryengine? that means all of your buildings are models from maya and all that bull crap. Hammer is so simple to make brushes and create any thing like you want like legos. Its perfectly fine! If it turns into a UDK im gonna stop mapping. Because i HATE UDK. And i HATE the way cryengine is for "brushes"

The only part i even remotely like is the "Real time" factor.
And i wish source could be better optimized so i can have 400 NPC's of win.

//End rant.

jangalomph wrote:Why do you guys want it to be so much like unreal and cryengine? that means all of your buildings are models from maya and all that bull crap. Hammer is so simple to make brushes and create any thing like you want like legos. Its perfectly fine! If it turns into a UDK im gonna stop mapping. Because i HATE UDK. And i HATE the way cryengine is for "brushes"

The only part i even remotely like is the "Real time" factor.
And i wish source could be better optimized so i can have 400 NPC's of win.

//End rant.

dude, it's not about turning it into an other editor
we just wan't better support and workflow improvement like the way you import models and textures
would be silly to even think we can get rid of the bsp system

Ahh, Importing models is one thing that made me stop modeling. *Must get back to modeling.. i've had a craving for it* And textures can be an arse too.

jangalomph wrote:Why do you guys want it to be so much like unreal and cryengine? that means all of your buildings are models from maya and all that bull crap. Hammer is so simple to make brushes and create any thing like you want like legos. Its perfectly fine! If it turns into a UDK im gonna stop mapping. Because i HATE UDK. And i HATE the way cryengine is for "brushes"

The only part i even remotely like is the "Real time" factor.
And i wish source could be better optimized so i can have 400 NPC's of win.

//End rant.

Models are faster to render, and the point of UDK and Cryengine is to have complex detailed enviroments. Doing it with bsp would be impossible.

Spike hit the nail on the head, if you can learn BSP you can learn modelling apps, its really not that hard (in fact its a very similar process).

I agree, but that's not going to happen anyway.. that would mean they would have to change the way their engine works, not just the editor

Yeah, they would have to change quite a bit to completely switch over to models. Though models do appear to be the future, I don't see Source going over to it any time soon.

Sandbox(cryengine's editor) and UDK are not really level creation tools in the same way Hammer is. Sandbox and UDK are tools that are used to put all of the content together and to make everything work together for the engine. Hammer creates the level geometry, places entities, optimizes(vis) and complies lighting.

Though, I wish Hammer could retain it's current capabilities and also gain that of the UDK and Sandbox. Such as stream lining the content importing process. Hammer could be the only real tool you need to interface your content with the engine(excluding programming). Hammer also needs to be fixed up, it feels quite bulky and has quite a few glitches.

A much better approach would be to make your buildings individually in Hammer - then have a process which compiles those to model format complete with hitboxes.

Once those models are ready, you then import them to your main map. TBH such a process would probably require a massive overhaul of the Source engine though, and the most recent engine fork of Source (L4D/AS) is pretty much unusable for anyone wanting to make a TC.

Saxon wrote:[...]most recent engine fork of Source (L4D/AS) is pretty much unusable for anyone wanting to make a TC.

Why is ASW useless for total conversions? It comes with code.


Also, no reason to even think that Valve will switch over to models for level geometry people soon... that's a bit too much, lighting and optimization methods would have to change... though, they could cheat and slowly transfer to models.

Gary wrote:Why is ASW useless for total conversions? It comes with code.

The two main problems are Sound and Models. For some reason sounds and models are a nightmare to setup in the latest version of Source. They require so much effort that they would kill a mod project in the blink of an eye.

Gary wrote:Also, no reason to even think that Valve will switch over to models for level geometry people soon... that's a bit too much, lighting and optimization methods would have to change... though, they could cheat and slowly transfer to models.

TBH I hope they'll do that for the engine which succeeds Source, though by that time I hope I'll be working instead of modding :F

I'm gonna bump this thread, to notify you guys of a thread I wrote on hlcoders.

http://www.opensubscriber.com/message/h ... 33763.html