somerandomnerd wrote:Terminator wrote:Read the Qu'ran, and you will find it instructs followers to not only lie to unbelievers...
No- it says not to lie to your fellow muslim. A huge difference in the context of the tribal society Mohamed brought peace to.
Exactly. It says lying is bad to a fellow believer, but deliberately instructs Muslims to lie to nonbelievers to further their own gains. To this day, Islamic nations forge false alliances with Western nations to make us complacent. Meanwhile, they build up their forces and bide their time for the right moment to attack. If Saudia Arabia or Iran had nuclear weapons, there is no doubt that they would use them against the West. Once they have such weapons, the only thing stopping them is the threat of annihilation from the Western retaliation. Do not be deceived...
Terminator wrote:...but to conquer and enslave those that you do not kill.
Where, exactly, does it state that? Can you provide a quote?
Sure. Here are two translated quotes.
The wording is not identical, but remember that the words of the Qur'an are intended to be taken at face value and not "interpreted", as the Bible is. The English is a little weird, but it is very old...
Surah 2:190-195
And fight in the cause of Allah with those who fight with you, and do not exceed the limits, surely Allah does not love those who exceed the limits. And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from where they drove you out, and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque (in Makkah) until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you, then slay them; such is the reward of the unbelievers. But if they desist, then surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. And fight with them until there is no persecution, and religion should be only for Allah, but if they desist, then there should be no hostility except against the oppressors.
Surah 47:4
Therefore, when ye meet the Unbelievers (in fight), smite at their necks; At length, when ye have thoroughly subdued them, bind a bond firmly (on them): thereafter (is the time for) either generosity or ransom: Until the war lays down its burdens. Thus (are ye commanded): but if it had been Allah's Will, He could certainly have exacted retribution from them (Himself); but (He lets you fight) in order to test you, some with others. But those who are slain in the Way of Allah,- He will never let their deeds be lost.
You can look all you like, but you will not find entries this graphic or suggestive in the Bible. So much for compairing the two...
What exactly does it say about "People of the Book"?
Chapter 23, called AL-MUMENOON (THE BELIEVERS), is all about what Allah owns and controls, and how his followers should trust Allah.
Numerous other chapters strictly address the way believers should worship Allah, fight for Allah in his name, and die for Allah. They also address how nonbelievers should be placed in dhimmitude after being conquered, how jihad is the highest honor one can give to Allah, and other facets of Islam worth mentioning...
Islam is no different in the respect that it says that Christians and Jews have been set on the wrong track by it's corrupt teachers. It says that the only true prophet is Mohamed, who was given the true word of god.
Technically, the Qur'an tells Muslims not to force Islam upon unbelievers, but the total lack of moral values means that these unbelievers are placed in dhimmas and persecuted until they renounce their religion and join Islam. This is one reason why Islam spreads so quickly... Worse, this is sanctioned by Islamic law, which is national law in most Islamic nations.
As for those who think Islam is a tolerant religion; newsflash time. Try this test on for size...
I dare you to enter Saudia Arabia holding a Bible, and we shall just see if you get two feet before you are arrested and shot. In Saudi Arabia, the Shari'ah (strict Islamic law) is State law, and it is brutally carried out. All other forms of religion are banned, under penalty of death. Does that sound very tolerant to you?
If you enter this country as a Muslim, then decide to convert to another faith and leave the country, the State police will excecute your family and hunt you down and cut off your head, even if you move to another country. This is the mandate punishment for apostacy (leaving the faith), and similar laws are in place throughout much of the Islamic world, chiefly in Iran, Egypt, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Qatar, Sudan, Mali, Ethiopia, and Somalia. Again, does that sound very tolerant to you?
Hundreds of thousand of Americans who converted from Islam now live in fear for their lives from this kind of behavior. Their government refuses to protect them because they refuse to recognize the threat. The same thing is happening in Europe, when Islamic immigration is reaching a critical population percentage in some cities, and these immigrants are attacking law enforcement and driving out non-Muslims. Not very tolerant, huh?
Islamic law is starting to emerge in Eastern Europe today, and those countries are converting to Islam by immigration. It is not something we Westerners will like at all, as Shari'ah is strongly opposed to our existing legal systems and moral values...
), and i dont have, and cant be arsed to get, information from that detailedness, so im affraid i wont be able to support whatever i am saying. From what ive heard from colleagues and friends which are muslim the muslim faith is as peacefull as any. Offcourse the history made them violent, all religions were violent. If they werent, they were gone (would you believe in a religion that tells you to love the people who believe in another god, while those other believers are killing your people by the thousands?).
), is that you are islamofobic. You seem to believe all resources that tell you the islam is bad and trying to conquer the world, and immediately disbelieve anyone that tells you otherwise.
