Chernobyl - HL2DM Map (download link)

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Re: Chernobyl - HL2DM Map (download link)

Postby lauris47 on Fri Jun 04, 2010 11:48 am

Major Banter wrote:Do bear in mind that Black Mesa source is being developed on computers that aren't massive rigs, and the incredibly complex silo level with the Hydra only needed an 8 hour final compile; lightcasting included.

You've fucked up your optimisation hugely.

I used custom compile tools for this map, maybe because of that (vbct).There was fast / full / final. Final with bumpmaping on every surface . But I'm happy with final result even if it is laggy. important thing is that i manage to finish this.. I faced many dificulities while creating this and learned more. Thanks for watching
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Re: Chernobyl - HL2DM Map (download link)

Postby Major Banter on Fri Jun 04, 2010 11:49 am

One final key point; a long compile and a laggy map are not mutually exclusive. An issue in one indicates an issue with the other.

If a compile is excessively long, there's been considerable shortfalls in the optimisation. Enough said.
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Re: Chernobyl - HL2DM Map (download link)

Postby Unstoppable Florence on Fri Jun 04, 2010 11:54 am

Dude, I don't think you are understanding this. We want to help you. Regardless of what you say, you have a serious problem here, VERY serious. You say you want to learn from this, well great! That's what we are here to help you do! So if you provide us with the VMF, we'll be able to figure out what's wrong and you'll learn how to get your maps working correctly.

Bad optimisation hurts you since compiles take far too long, and it hurts your audience because... let's face it, you should never, ever relese a map done on fast compile. I just gave it a test drive: the cubemaps were beyond screwed (I even tried rebuilding them, no effect) and the game was stuttering. My rig runs ep2 at a consistent 100fps at max settings, it should not be having issues with this.
Dives wrote:Source is kinda like that really old guy in your family that keeps getting older and older and just won't die, but he tells really great stories. And craps the bed on occasion.
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Re: Chernobyl - HL2DM Map (download link)

Postby lauris47 on Fri Jun 04, 2010 11:58 am

I started this "coliseo" map I think before starting abandoned/chernobyl : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xuzz4sjO4vk . i have dificulities going further on this one .. because of source limits .. bruhes is limited in engine and to bypass this I used method converting brushwork to models .. everything is good now, but now walls is to light i areas where it should be darker ..
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i used info_lighting , without that things are even wors, like black models.. If someone knows how could i correct lighting on models please help .
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Re: Chernobyl - HL2DM Map (download link)

Postby Major Banter on Fri Jun 04, 2010 12:09 pm

Out of curiousity did you ever use func_detail in that Chernobyl map?
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Re: Chernobyl - HL2DM Map (download link)

Postby lauris47 on Fri Jun 04, 2010 12:25 pm

Major Banter wrote:Out of curiousity did you ever use func_detail in that Chernobyl map?

Used a lot. Somewher didn't used because detail / brush does not work together with areaportal in same room. And area portal is way better tool for optimizing so I used this method more.
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Re: Chernobyl - HL2DM Map (download link)

Postby sacrifist on Sat Aug 21, 2010 3:47 am

Since when did hint/skip not work in mp maps?
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Re: Chernobyl - HL2DM Map (download link)

Postby Mr. Happy on Mon Sep 13, 2010 4:44 am

lauris47 wrote:What ? I optimized in best way to optimize this map. used portals ocluders .. hint/skip does not work in mp ...


hints are vital and do work in multiplayer. so do areaportals, just not as useful
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Re: Chernobyl - HL2DM Map (download link)

Postby Groxkiller585 on Wed Sep 15, 2010 10:37 am

Well, laggy or not, SOMETHING is wrong if it takes two WEEKS to compile! Even large maps that take most of the gird don't take that long. You really must've done something to mess up your map internally.

Did you func_detail ALL geometry not used/is static and is not sealing the map from the void?

Did you use areaportals extensively? Areaportals should be used sparingly, too many causes lag, not to mention longer compile times.

Did you use alot of an expensive shader, like say refracts or water? I'm sure if the map is large that would have commited to some of the compile time as well as lagg ingame.
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Re: Chernobyl - HL2DM Map (download link)

Postby Major Banter on Wed Sep 15, 2010 5:24 pm

Postby lauris47 on Fri Jun 04, 2010 12:25 pm

Genius, gentlemen.
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Re: Chernobyl - HL2DM Map (download link)

Postby Groxkiller585 on Wed Sep 15, 2010 7:49 pm

Major Banter wrote:Postby lauris47 on Fri Jun 04, 2010 12:25 pm

Genius, gentlemen.



Oops. :oops:
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Re: Chernobyl - HL2DM Map (download link)

Postby YokaI on Sat Sep 18, 2010 6:35 am

Hints and skips are nice, but the biggest component to hint / skip is where they are placed. Honestly, there's no golden rule to optimization and there's no "sure fire" optimization technique that "magically" gets your maps to run like butter. Valve can't even really do that!

The things you haven't mentioned greatly impact the performance of the map and the compile times:
~ Areaportals
~ func_details
~ WELL POSITIONED hints/skips. If placed poorly, you are only increasing compile time.

Area Portals are basically an easy way to make segments of the map run faster since it basically (and I mean super basic) isolates that section of the map for the graphics card to even consider. Func_details on complicated and detailed brushwork will save compile time since Vvis can basically skip over it unlike the foundation brushwork (I.E. the brushwork that keeps the map from encountering leaks.)

Other things you should consider adding are func_occluders and some basic optimization decisions with entities (making point_spotlights not dynamic, increasing fade distance on props.)

And actually, compile times and optimization are not directly related. If your map compiles take forever, it's probably an optimization issue. However, if it compiles super fast, it can also be an optimization error. The only way to properly assess your maps compiles / optimizations is by observing the budget (show_budget) and observing wireframes to see what's rendering where and why it's rendering.
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