TF2: cp_silo-c (Beta 4A)

[Swiftmind]

Thanks again Jgoodroad.

you should put more BTS areas

I plan too but holding off until I know the new layout is solid. But in the new version (B3) I went ahead and added some new BTS areas

your doors do not have proper head-room a header should only be 16units height

I have no idea what you are talking about here. Are you saying doors are not high enough? If so which ones.

the second area is WAY to confusing to navigate, and the spawn seems to be the opposite of the first spawn

Do you mean round 2? Yes it is confusing which is the whole point of the change mentioned in the last Dev Update about the new Round 2 layout. Not sure what you mean about the spawns, the two spawn rooms are right on top of each other in B2. In B3 this is not the case.

my only problem was the fact that it is red ground, and blu does not need to pass through it, you should give red a more defensive stand on the last map.

Right. Check out the next Dev Update for Round 3 layout and tell me what you think.

[Swiftmind]

B3 Dev Update: Round 3 Layout

Round 3 layout was alright except for these few issues:

* The map is named Silo C, yet when the players finally get to the Silo it ends up being a side attraction.
* Main route for blue is not as clearly laid out as it can be. The top level flanks are a long round about way compared to the lower route.
* It is very hard for red to retake the top level of the Control Room once blue has a force on the top.
* Defense is difficult for a final point since blue can come from all sides.

Keeping this in mind, here is the new layout for round 3.



Note: This is a simple representation.

The ICBM Silo is now the staging point for blue. It is the first major area blue will enter and it is where blue can split off to assault the control room (CR).

A new path to the CR has been added on the lower floor. This is the left side hallway to CR. This will basically be a mirror image of the right side hallway to CR.

The upper level right flank from the Silo to the CR has been removed.

Main Route: Blue pushes and takes over the Silo. Then can split off into the following three routes to get into the control room:
* The left or right hallways on the lower level.
* Get up to the second level within the Silo using the beams and use the right side hallway on the upper level. This is a "backdoor flank" and will be the longest travel time.

Once blue gets into the lower level of CR, they need to fight up the stairs to the control point.

Red will now spawn on the upper level of CR in a split spawn. This is similar to Dustbowls last point spawn. Red will also be allowed to enter the Silo during setup.

That is it! Next update will be about Round 2 area changes.

[Swiftmind]

B3 Dev Update: Round 2 Area Changes

Time to show progress.

Travel Tunnels:
Only blue has these tunnels now and the conduit is a detail only area.





Living Quarters:
This area had the most changes.



As you can see the lighting has changed a lot. The "Red Ledge" has been moved closer to the other ledge. One can see that the "Red stairway" has been moved next to the restroom. This will make it easier for blue to run up the stairway if needed. In the 'after' picture, near the bottom right, an in lit has been added for a new sentry spot.

A third floor has been added for detail, it is inaccessible. A forth floor may be added.

The upper floor was completely rebuilt and detailed.



This is a areal view of the upper floor. The two ledges of the upper floor are now connected via the hallway near the bottom right. Blue can now run up either stairway and be able to access both upper floor areas without going back down to the lower floor. This greatly reduces the power of the sentry spot on the top floor and forces red to be more clever about defense and spread farther apart. Red also now enters LQ from the right of this picture, no longer from the left.



Fuel:
Fuel's overall layout remains the same. The changes made are lighting, the hut around the point is now a metal shack, new textures and a new models. Red now enters the Fuel area on the other side.



The top of the fuel silos are buildable again to give Red more areas to place sentries. This has to be tested to see if it is a good idea or not.



A new metal shack has been added. This was added to give Red a remote base area with more cover on the top floor.



Engineering:
Engineering has been moved to the other side of the round. It is now directly connected to Fuel and LQ to mimic a Gravelpit layout. Red now spawns in the back of Engineering.



Living Quarters has two ways into Engineering:
1) Stairs going to top level
2) Hallway to mid level

Fuel has two ways:
1) Hallway to mid level
2) Ramp down to lower level.



A new catwalk has been added between the mid level ledges. This replaced the orange wall in the 'before' picture. Now players do not need to run all the way around past the Red spawn exit to get to the other side. This ledge makes the stairway to the top level a lot more accessible and opens up a new sentry spot.



Red Spawn:

The new Red spawn is split between two levels. Red spawn exits on mid and top level of Engineering. Since top level mainly goes to LQ, we wanted to give Red an easier way to get down to the mid level spawn exit. Thus a large elevator hole was added to allow red players to jump down.





Thats it for round 2. As for round 3, changes are around 50% complete. The next dev update will be the last before B3 release!

[Swiftmind]

B3 Dev Update: Round 3 Area Changes

What has been going on with Round 3 you ask, well here you go.

Blue Spawn:
Blue spawn as been moved to the new layout position.



Now blue must fight their way into Silo C and take it over. Through the Silo Blue has three ways into the Control Room, seen in the background of the screenshot. The Silo beams will still be used to get up to the second level for the flank path. The lower floor has two ways into the Control Room.




This is the new route into the Control Room. It is very similar to the other lower floor entrance. Behind the screenshot includes a small hallway and security office with some ammo. Each team could build a base there.



Control Room:
Basic layout of the CR has not changed. Lighting increased, more health on the lower floor. The main path for Blue is to enter the CR through one of the two lower floor entrances and fight their way up the stairway. This has been tested with bots and it seems to work well...for bots hehe.


Here is the new way into the CR. Notice the dark tile on the floor. This subtle way to show the path to the CP has been kept.



Red spawn has been moved to the upper floor and split into two spawn rooms on opposite sides of the upper floor. Both can be seen in this screen shot. Red has resupply lockers again. All ammo/health packs around the CP have been removed. Notice the handrails have changed. The handrails are props again, not brushes, which means players can shoot through them once again. Also the HL2 prop on the ledge has been replaced by a simple brush based control panel with a custom panel texture.



That is it! We are now just running around and making minor changes. We plan to have B3 out within the next few days!

[jgoodroad]

great improvement, and I feel that b4 will be another step up.

[Swiftmind]

Got a great dev update for all of you!

Beta 3 has been released!

Enjoy.
=========================
Silo C
Version: beta 3

Revision Log:

Map Wide:

* Removed:
- Music and radios
- Small HL crates
* All lighting reworked, luminosities greatly increased
* Several soundscapes changed
* Added new models, overlays, textures
* Decrease T-junctions/waterindices, brush sides
* Optimized visportals


Round 1:
* Blue can now leave spawn room during setup
* New quick path added between SH and blue vent exit
* Alarm removed in locker room
* Maintenance hallway by locker room detailed

Data Link:
* Front entrance rebuilt; breakable glass removed

Security Hub:
* Layout and Style rebuilt
* All breakable glass removed
* Access to both quick paths added on upper level


Round 2:

* Redesigned layout. Layout now Gravelpit style
* Gate system and Red tunnels removed
* Fuel Conduit detail only
* Blue gates remain open after setup

Living Quarters:
* Upper level redesigned. Ledges now connected
* Detail/real lights added on upper level
* Added third level, detail only

Fuel:
* Hut around CP now made of metal sheets
* Added new structure on top level
* Fuel mid floor now equal to lower floor of LQ
* Fuel moved slightly towards LQ

Engineering:
* Moved to other side of round 2
* Now directly connected to Fuel/LQ
* New catwalk added to connect second level on both sides
* Detail only areas added

Red Spawn:
* Moved behind Engineering
* Split between two floors


Round 3:

* Blue spawn now exits into the Silo only
* New lower floor route to CR added
* Red min spawn time increased to 8

Silo C:
* Fixed/simplified Silo inner dome floor
* Blastdoor used on upper floor entrance to Silo remains open

Control Room:
* Red can leave CR during setup
* Handrails in CR now props, can be shot through
* Health added to lower floor. Health/ammo removed on upper floor
* Red spawn moved to CR upper floor
* Red now has resupply lockers

[Swiftmind]

B4 Dev Update: Round 1

Round 1 layout seemed to work sometimes, then not other times. The main problem was the need for one way gates and blue's forward spawn. Futhermore the curved "hallway of death" sometimes became a great bottleneck.

A new layout has been worked out with these goals in mind:
*Remove blue forward spawn
*Remove gates
*Create a better "forward" flow
*Remove bottlenecks
*Decrease travel times

Blue Spawn and exits: Blue spawn has been rotated and moved. The vent will now be closed until Data Link is capped. When the round starts, Blue will only come from the lobby. This will help in defense since Blue will come from one general area. Movement flow for Blue will be far easier to understand since it will generally be a forward flow. The vent will open once Data Link is capped, but it may be fully removed if proved useless.


Here is what the new blue spawn layout looks like. A thrid exit has been added to aid Blue's unwelcomed entrance into the area.


Data Link: This area remains relatively the same. The backdoor by the engineer NPC is now bigger. The cap time has been increased. The glass has been removed in the projector room. The floor under the CP is now a white tile.


Security Hub:

NOTE: In the before picture, Round 2 can be seen in the background. This may be a little confusing to look at. In the after picture round 2 was not compiled into the developer version.

Security Hub has been rotated and moved to the start of the curved hallway. This allows a lot more flexability in the layout and decreases travel time. Blue forward spawn has been removed. The curved hallway is now a detail only area.

A new way into the SH area has been added on the left side of the After picture. This connects the DL hallway to the SH balcony overlooking the stairs and into the hallway leading towards the curved hallway.

A new overlook balcony has been added on the right side of the After picture. This will favor Blue more then Red and will give Blue a different point to drop down to the lower floor. It can also serve as an Engineer base. This route is the longest for Blue.



Here is the side route into the SH. The vent exit for Blue (lower part of picture), now serves as a easy direct route to this area. Even though this exits onto the second floor of the SH, Red can easily defend this entrance.



Here is what the player will see. The overpowered balcony that everyone used before has now been split up. This forces players to use the lower floor far more then before. On the left is the new overlook balcony.


Setup Time: Increased by 15 seconds to 1 minute, 15 seconds.

Minimum Spawn Times: During DL, Red is now 4 seconds, Blue 5. Once DL is capped, Red has 6 seconds, Blue 4.


That is it! The next Dev Update will present Round 2 changes.

[jgoodroad]

in the last pick the ceiling texture seems a bit streched

[Swiftmind]

B4 Dev Update: Round 2

Once again Round 2 has gone through some major layout changes. Maneuverability and flanking routes have been sacrificed for very simple, direct paths. All routes that can be taken by a player will now always go to a CP. This means it will be far harder for blue to take a point and far easier to defend every point. After playing this round with bots, the layout seems to work far better due to its simplicity.


Cap Times: Fuel and LQ cap times increased to 40 seconds for one person.


Blue Spawn: Blue spawn has been moved back behind the travel tunnels.


Blue spawn is the Blue/White walled room. Blue can no longer reach the middle of the map out of spawn.


Living Quarters:

Blue enters LQ from spawn by these two doors only. The curved hallway has been removed.



Blue has three routes to the CP, the hallway, the men's restroom or the recreation room. All these routes end next to the CP as before.

The upper floor of LQ remains unchanged.


Before, this area was the intersection that contained tons of signs. It has been reduced to this very simple state. Straight on goes to fuel, going up the stairs to Engineering/LQ.


Red's paths to LQ is the same as before.


Fuel:

Blue has two gates into Fuel on the lowest floor.



Blue only has to go up the ramps. Now if any blue claims they are still lost in Fuel, they need to be slapped.


The corridor that went under the large fan has been removed completely.

Red Defense is now very simple, hold the top. Blue will come from one direction, unless Blue comes from LQ/Engineering.


Red enters Fuel in almost the same way. The mid level entrance remains unchanged. But the other Red way into Fuel has been moved to the Top level.

The metal hut seen in the center of the screenshot has been expanded a bit. It now houses the entrance to LQ. This LQ entrance used to be on the mid level, but for simplicity it was moved to the top level.


This is the back of Fuel. All old paths have been removed. This forces Red to always go up to the top, similar to what happens to Blue.


Engineering: This area had a major rework. It was way too small for the design of the place. Engineering has been expanded to form a large T.


One can see this adds a lot more floor space to move around. This also worked well with the connections to LQ/Fuel. Now the flow is VERY simple. Blue enters the area from the bottom of the screen shot, red respawn is at the top of the screen shot.


The top level of Engineering has been connected to Fuel. This makes navigation to the other points far easier.

In the background one can see the new connection between LQ, Fuel.


Mid level of Engineering. Much more room to work with and Red can clearly see where to go and where Blue will come from.



Bottom is larger now. The area next to the large fan can be used as a good sentry spot for defense. The CP was rotated to open up the point to this sentry spot.



The stair situation has changed. A new staircase was added between mid/bottom level. The staircase to the top level has been made one single staircase that favors Red.


As mentioned before this layout seems to work far better then previous. It is far easier to understand and navigate and will hopefully prove much more fun.

This is the last Dev Update before release of Beta 4! The changes to Round 3 are minimal.

[jgoodroad]

can you slim down the metal rafters at fuel? they seem really thick and blocky

[Swiftmind]

Beta 4 Released!

After taking in a lot of feedback, I have made a bunch of changes. I feel the map overall works far better now. I hope you all agree. Have fun! Please, let me know what you think of the new version.


Changelog:
Map Wide:
* Setup time increased to 1 min, 15 sec

Round 1:
* Rotated Security, stairs start at the beginning of curved hallway
* Removed one way gates, blue forward spawn
* Curved hallway now detail only
* Added new path between DL/SH
* Travel times decreased between CPs

Blue Spawn:
* Blue spawn rotated and moved
* Blue vent path closed until after DL is capped
* Blue can only enter the area through lobby before DL cap
* Third gate/door for blue added in lobby


Round 2:
* Moved blue spawn back behind travel tunnels
* Blue can no longer reach the middle of the round through spawn
* Rebuilt all paths around CPs to force players to run past the CPs
* Increased cap times for Fuel/LQ to 35 seconds for one player

Living Quarters:
* Rebuilt sections of lower level
* Curved hallway removed
* New gate for blue added on bottom level near travel tunnels
* The lower level area that had tons of signs has been rebuilt and made simpler

Fuel:
* Removed the path under the large vent
* Most of the mid level hallway removed
* New connection to Engineering made on top level
* Connection to LQ moved to top level
* Increased size of metal hut on the side
* "Old School" fan replaced by prop
* New gate for blue added on bottom level

Engineering:
* Rebuilt. Sized increased. Layout now a large T
* All connections to Engineering moved to one general area. No more connections go to the side of Engineering
* Increased size of mid level ledges
* Added additional staircase between lower/mid level
* Staircase between mid/top level now one straight staircase
* Top level of engineering connected to Fuel


Round 3:
* Cap time decreased by 5 seconds to 8 seconds for one person
* Removed breakable glass and increased size of window for the security booths in hallways
* Moved ammo out of the security booths to hallway

[Swiftmind]

Dev Update: Beta 4 Feedback and Minor Release B4A

Hey all, time to list some general feedback gathered after observing several plays of the map on different servers.

Overall Feedback:
* Vast improvement from Beta 3.
* Layout far easier to understand/ learn. But still some areas need polishing.
* Engineering is tough to cap, Control Room almost impossible.

Spawn Time Issues: It has been observed that several servers are changing the minimum team spawn times to much lower times then what is set by the map. This is making a big impact within Engineering and Control Room. For instance, the following happens:

Control Room Minimum Respawn Times:
Map Values: Blue – 5 secs. Red – 8 secs.
Server Values: Blue – 3 secs. Red – 5 secs. Another server had both
teams at 2 secs!

This is making those areas very hard to cap. Best solution is to change some cap times and layouts since servers are independent. Also since most of the map seems to work alright with lower spawn times, some respawn times will be decreased slightly.


Minor Release: Beta 4A (b4a)
It has been decided to do a new release of Beta 4. This entails making
areas more balanced and fixing some issues.

Round 1:



Glass was added between the two floors so players on the lower floor will noticed the big rotating CP sign above.



On the upper floor, the back window was removed. This opens up the upper level more which decreases the strength of the defensive camping position around the CP.


Round 2:
Fuel:
Many found it annoying while running towards Engineering to run up and over the Fuel tanks within Fuel. This caused the routes from Fuel to Engineering to be hardly used. The old mid level hallway is back. This connects the mid level Engineering entrance to the other side of Fuel.



This hallway will be gated off until Engineering is capable. At the far end of the hallway near Engineering, sits a one way gate, similar to gates found in Dustbowl. This new hallway will be a very useful route for blue to utilize.

Engineering:
Players can no longer
* build on the staircases
* shoot through the staircase slits

The full ammo pack has been removed on the bottom floor. Red engineers built up on the lowest floor far too fast for blue to counter.

Capture time has been decreased by 3 seconds.


Round 3:
In most plays of the map, the game stagnates here. But hey this is the last point; it is supposed to be the hardest challenge. But to help balance out this area, the capture time has been decreased by 3 seconds.



This red respawn room has been rebuilt to be made larger and moved slightly farther away from the CP. It is now the same distance from the CP as the other respawn room.

Blue spawn has had a slight change, ramps have been added in the front (where the pyro suits in the tanks are).

A very faint light was added in the dark office to make the room slightly brighter.

[Swiftmind]

Beta 4A has been released!

B4a changelong:

Round 1:
* Removed back window of Security Hub top level.
* Respawn times after capping DL have been reduced by one second
* Added crates at the open ledge overlooking SH area to provide a flat
surface for sentries
* Moved forklift outside the vent room exit. Moved the full
health/ammo towards exit


Round 2:
* Decreased starting respawn times for both teams by 2 secs
* Respawn times during Engineering cap decreased by 1 sec for both teams
* Cap time for Engineering decreased by 3 seconds
* Nobuilds added on stairs in engineering
* Can no longer shoot through stairs in engineering
* Full ammo pack removed on bottom level of engineering
* Mid level hallway in Fuel added to provide quickpath to engineering
once area is capable


Round 3:
* Added new ramps in blu spawn
* Added small health on second level of silo
* Decreased cap time by 3 secs
* Rebuilt red respawn room with security camera terminal
* Faint light added in dark office

[jgoodroad]

I was looking at earlier pics, so I don't know if it still applies, but the rug in the lobby (round 1) seems to be off-center to the desk, it should be centered to the entry and the desk...

and did you ever slim down those rafters? I can understand a few main ones being that thick but it seems a bit excessive at some points. in other cases they could just be replaced with concrete pillars.

[Swiftmind]

can you slim down the metal rafters at fuel? they seem really thick and blocky

Oh opps I must have missed this comment from before. Rafters? Do you mean the green beam pillars? The vertical or horizontal ones? The reason behind the vertical thickness is twofold, 1) to fill in the empty space between the fuel storage containers and to be thick and strong since its holding up the large ceiling. Detail like this has not been on top priority but I will be starting to finish up detail to its final state, so I will take another look at these.


As for the rug, I think I know what you mean. I cannot remember if I ever changed it.